DT125R ARCHIVE

Calum122 · Guru

Dual Radiator Setup?

Energized · DTR Legend

Don't bother, just put a NOS bottle there and make up a solenoid and wire everything up. Best option.

Calum122 · Guru

Oh. I thought i replied to you enny. Lol was pretty much the jist.

Well i've decided to persist even if it is on my own. So i've bought a dtr oil bottle subframe. No way am i chopping my frame.

My dads got a small welder so i can get to weld in new brackets. I think with that in mind it shouldn't be too dificult.

The reason why i want to do this is that i eventually want to run that tzr setup. And the tzr runs that massivr radiator compared to the dt. So dual rads need to be installed.

-- Edited by Calum122 on Friday 27th of September 2013 09:42:59 AM

AndyYam · Guru

i personally wouldnt bother. I'd buy some high quality waterless coolant. That will help keep it cooler.

AndyYam · Guru

Evans is a good one.

Calum122 · Guru

Cheers andy.

Yeah i will do that. And have the extra radiator. Theres got to be more gained than lost. Already started buying parts i'll need. Like spare frame parts. The oil bottle holder. So i can weld it up and not worry about damaging my bike.

Calum122 · Guru

Just had a look at that evans stuff. Sounds more like snake oil.

It claims to have a higher boiling point. Great but my dt shouldn't boil over. That would cause detention. Don't want that. Or pre ignition. F1 cars don't use.

AndyYam · Guru

Lol snake oil seems to be your favourite saying at the moment Cal :P

Heres a little quote from a forum i found when i was researching it.

"There are quite a few advantages to using a waterless coolant. For one thing your cooling system and components will last almost forever. The coolant is permanent so coolant flushes etc. are eliminated and oxide buildup in the cooling system is eliminated. Waterless coolant boiling point is over 375 degrees f. The high boiling point keeps pressure buildup in the cooling system down so much you can remove the radiator cap from a hot engine without worry about coolant blowing out. While it is true that water/coolant blend has a slightly better ability to remove heat it offers far less protection due to the fact that it requires a pressurized system to raise the boiling point high enough to act as a coolant and also has a rapid failure point when your engine gets very hot. A really hot engine produces a vapor barrier on hot surfaces that causes hot spots and overheating and engine damage potential that the waterless coolant will not. You can run an engine with waterless coolant at very high temperatures without damage that an engine using typical coolant blended with water would boil over and stop. The higher boiling point of the waterless coolant can cool a very hot engine a lot better because it will not produce vapor and boil over. The coolant with water even though it can remove more heat reaches its failure point at its lower boiling point and loses its ability to cool. I have personally run an engine on my desert bike with a bad water pump over 15 miles with no coolant circulation and did not boil over or damage the engine. I had to to get back to camp. If I had coolant with water in it this would not have been possible. I know others have their own opinions about this but after 15 plus years running Evans waterless coolant in all my vehicles I am sold. "

Basically, you never need to replace your coolant again and it will never corode. In cars it can increase fuel efficiency.

An interesting vid here with Jay Leno. www.greencarreports.com/news/1071361_waterless-coolant-improves-engine-life-boosts-mpg-10-percent

Calum122 · Guru

I went on their website. And they were bragging about a lower specific heat capacity.

Now go and look up what that means. And then come back and explain to me why that's better.

AndyYam · Guru

Calum122 wrote:
I went on their website. And they were bragging about a lower specific heat capacity.

Now go and look up what that means. And then come back and explain to me why that's better.

Calm yourself Cal mate im only offering an alternative and suggesting a well known quality product mate. Nothing to get your nose out of joint about.

The benefits seem worth the money for me but hey, your choice.

-- Edited by AndyYam on Thursday 3rd of October 2013 07:21:19 PM

ezegreenfingers · Guru

I got dual radiators on my ktm

AndyYam · Guru

Wirth regards to the lower specific heat capacity it appears to mean that the lower the specific heat capacity the less energy is needed for it to heat up. Yes that means that the indicated coolant temperature could be higher but that doesnt mean the combustion temperature will be higher. Afterall the coolant is there to absorb the heat from the engine and not the other way around Cal. From what I've read and researched on the stuff, alot of people who started using it did so because they had overheating/detonation problems with their car or bike. Once they started using it these problems went away and they know they will never have to buy coolant for their engine again, or have to worry about corrosion. Obviosuly its not on your christmas list but don't start getting shirty over it just because youre not interested.

Calum122 · Guru

Sorry mate. Didn't mean that to come across as aggressive. Sorry if it did. I mean't it as in read it up for yourself and let me know what you think. Sorry about that. Messages are always hard to convey your tone across.

Nah. I've studied physics in a bit of depth and studied thermal dynamics. Specific heat capacity is defined as the amount of energy required to raise a 1 kg mass's temperature by 1 degrees Celsius. So to have a coolant that needs less energy to raise it's heat is just madness. You want something with a high specific heat capacity. So it can take more heat energy (Remember that is what heat is, energy) away from the cylinder. The higher the value, the more heat it can take away from the cylinder.

The only way I can see that coolant being effective is that the Specific heat capacity is such that it actually dissapates heat faster and thus can remain cooler. Remember what Specifi Heat Capacity is. It works the other way too! If it needs less energy to heat up it will dissapate that heat quicker too. So It's almost as if it equals itself out. It heats up quicker but it gets rid of that heat quicker too. Whereas normal coolant takes longer to heat up but holds that heat.

I think by typing it out I've just answered my own question though. With some help from you of course.

So if we go on what you said about all coolant is is to take energy away from the cylinder. It would then make sense to have something that loses that heat via the radiator quicker too. But the problem still stands IMO. The DT radiator is just too small! If it were bigger it would lose more heat energy and this waterless coolant would become effective. I think ultimately having both would be work well.

AndyYam · Guru

I can see what you're saying but I'd have to go back to the fact that Yamaha would have fitted an adequate radiator when they designed the bike. Unless you've upgraded your engine so that it will need more cooling, i cant see it being worth the effort for the minimal gain you might get. If you had a big bore kit then I could see the point. I just dont want you to waste your money and time dude. If you do go for it, I'd lookin into better water pump impeller. Let me know how you get on. Have you not done your full test then? If so, buy a wr200. Theres a couple on ebay every now and then. If not, do your test dude!

Calum122 · Guru

Yeah mate. It will be running a tzr belgarda 4dl lump. Which is why i want better cooling.

Almost. Mod 1 is done. Just waiting on mod 2. But i wouldn't get rid of my baby anyway.

AndyYam · Guru

Ah yeah i forgot you were putting a tzr engine in there. total coolant capacity of the 4dl is 1.1litre. Probably worth making sure the capacity is the same as that i suppose.

Good luck with the mod2, its just like going for a ride.

dan28 · DTR Senior Member

I don't understand how the coolant will flow between both the radiators
probably better to get a custom radiator with a larger core

Calum122 · Guru

What? Umm by radiator hoses. How else? It'll be fine lol.

AndyYam · Guru

They have dual set ups on YZ125's and a few others Dan. It has joints at the top and the bottom so its effectivly one rad in terms of water movement. It has to fit around the main tube of the frame whereas the tzr and other bikes of that style have the Deltabox style frame and so the rad can go right across the front. Thats the only reason they are dual set ups. It's a 200ml difference between the TZR capacity and the DT. My own view would be to run it for a while and see how the temp is doing with the standard radiator. As long as you change the gear oil regularly (which also acts as cooling for the engine) then I'm sure it would be fine.

Calum122 · Guru

I'm not even concerned about cooling. I just think it would look cool.

the only way is YAMAHA DTR · Guru

These would look lush, made for dt200wr $T2eC16h,!yUE9s6NG(5PBQ2lcQ,I4Q~~60_57.JPG

Calum122 · Guru

Mate they're a sound price too! And the feedback the sellers got. For all the radiators are generally good.

It's getting it to fit the frame and what not.

Calum122 · Guru

Well with help of Scrim and my brother I'm closer than ever... hopefully have this finished this weekend..

Calum122 · Guru

Luke · Guru

That actually looks nice.

Is the standard radiator on the right on the DTRE/X models? I know the oil tank is under the seat instead of there like on the R models. :)

Calum122 · Guru

No, I've removed the standard radiator now :( No, it was just a bunch of relays and the rectifier. I had to move those which meant removing my beloved HID kit which I've now sold. Well worth buying though lmao. Mad light!

dan28 · DTR Senior Member

HAs the dual setup solved your cooling issue or is the temp still high
Can I see a pic of how you mounted your oil bottle please

Calum122 · Guru

Oil botttle on the re is at the back. Has this solved the cooling issue. Dunno. Probably not.

The bike is in two boxes now ready for a rebuild. So don't have any photos.

AndyYam · Guru

Glad to see this is still going well :P